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Simultaneously use dialogue and punctuation with just a few simple rules!
Okay, I'm sick of this ruining otherwise good stories. Here's how you use punctuation and dialogue at the same time(!):
Let's just say Dean and Sam are in a bar. Dean has just told Sam to take the goddamn pool cue and bludgeon that succubus over the head with it. There are a few things Sam could say in response. Here are the options:
Note that:
right, next lesson. Here's another thing Sam could say in response to Dean's 'request':
Note that:
Another (boy, this is fun!):
Note that:
Here's a different kind:
Note that:
Last one on sentencing with dialogue:
Note that:
Now to talk about paragraphing! Hoorah!
Note that:
And if you're writing a Lord of the Rings crossover, you might find yourself wielding hefty paragraphs, nay, pages of dialogue, that is hopefully broken up into paragraphs. But wait - that's confusing! You only start a new paragraph if it's a new speaker, don't you? WRONG! Here's how you do it:
Note that:
Wasn't that fun? And while I'm at it, please do not include any of the following terms or their variations in your fanfiction:
I know you might have the urge to 'mix it up' when you feel like you've just typed 'Dean' for the fifth time in one sentence, or if all your characters are male and your 'he's are getting confusing, but studies have proven* that the brain doesn't process names that way - they don't really notice them linguistically, only as signifiers. So the reader is going to be more jolted out of the story by you saying "the eldest Winchester" or "the freckled demon-hunter" instead of Dean for the second time in five words, which they won't even process. Mmmkay? Trust me on this one.
Er, I've used a couple of these name-alternatives in the examples above to demonstrate correct and incorrect uses of upper- and lower-case (as names always start with uppercase).
Please feel free to share this post with anyone you think desperately, desperately needs it. Cmon, fanfic readers and anal grammaticians web-wide, represent!
PS. uh, if you're an actual grammatician, feel free to correct me. Because, like, I was never actually properly taught grammar, I just read bucketloads and know what feels right. Like.
* please don't ask me what studies, I have no idea, it's third-hand knowledge, but I do know as a dedicated fanfiction reader that I really, really notice more when you use these bullshit name-alternatives.
eta: at![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
almostnever's suggestion, I've changed all the 'inverted commas' in this to 'quotation marks', which ought to be more universally recognisable terminology :D
Let's just say Dean and Sam are in a bar. Dean has just told Sam to take the goddamn pool cue and bludgeon that succubus over the head with it. There are a few things Sam could say in response. Here are the options:
Wrong way:
"What" Sam said incredulously "Dean, I'm not hitting that succubus over the head. She'll curse us so we have to dry-hump each other to death"
Right way:
"What?" Sam said incredulously. "Dean, I'm not hitting that succubus over the head. She'll curse us so we have to dry-hump each other to death."
Note that:
- the dialogue (those words between the "quotation marks") have punctuation. Within the quotation marks. There needs to be punctuation before every single closing quotation marks that you are using for dialogue, be it . or ! or ? or , or even - or ...
- the passage is divided into three separate sentences. Note that sentence structure, in terms of punctuation, disregards "quotation marks". In other words, quotation marks do not automatically signify the beginning or end of a sentence. The first sentence in this passage is "What?" Sam said incredulously. The second is "Dean, I'm not hitting that succubus over the head. [third:] She'll curse us so we have to dry-hump each other to death." Thus, the beginning of each sentence requires a capital letter, and the end of each sentence requires a period or equivalent.
right, next lesson. Here's another thing Sam could say in response to Dean's 'request':
Wrong way:
"Wait" He mumbles hazily, like he's a few Tibetan prayer flags to the wind. "you want me to what?"
Right way:
"Wait," he mumbles hazily, like he's a few Tibetan prayer flags to the wind. "You want me to what?"
Note that:
- We're working on the 'sentence structure that 'ignores' quotation marks' rule again. The first sentence is "Wait," he mumbles hazily, like he's a few Tibetan prayer flags to the wind. And here's my pet peeve, folks: remember, if you're continuing the sentence beyond the "dialogue" (which you will be doing, if you're using your authorial text - i.e. your not-dialogue - to refer to the dialogue - eg. he said, he exclaims, etc) you need to put a comma immediately before you close the quotation marks.
I'm not saying that you can't put anything else there. I'm saying that if you're breaking up the dialogue (eg. "Start of sentence," he said. "Continuing to speak.") you need to punctuate before you close the quotation marks. You can use a ! or ? or ... or whatever, but remember, only use a period/full stop (.) if the following sentence is a new sentence (see example a couple below). This whole comma thing can seem confusing, but don't think of it in terms of how the comma sounds - don't think of your character speaking that comma. They can speak the exclamation mark or question mark or ellipses, but the comma is for grammatical reasons, and is CRUCIAL. - Again, on the sentence-structure thing; the second sentence is "You want me to what?" and thus has to start with a captial letter. This is another grammatical thing - a sentence has just ended prior to this one; regardless of whether you hear that character speak in a continuous sentence, the capital letter after the full stop (inside or outside of the quotation marks) it is also crucial.
Another (boy, this is fun!):
Wrong way:
"Dean!" His brother exclaims, as if his dignity has been mortally offended.
Right way:
"Dean!" his brother exclaims, as if his dignity has been mortally offended.
Note that:
- This is a complete sentence. The authorial description of the dialogue (his brother exclaims) is included in the sentence with the dialogue. Therefore, regardless of the punctuation before the closing quotation marks, there is no capital letter following it.
Here's a different kind:
Wrong way:
"I don't think so," He takes a long pull of his beer before slamming it back on the table, "We're getting out of here."
Right way:
"I don't think so." He takes a long pull of his beer before slamming it back on the table. "We're getting out of here."
Note that:
- muahahah I know, I'm tricksy, aren't I? There are three sentences in this passage. First: "I don't think so." Second: He takes a long pull of his beer before slamming it back on the table. Third: "We're getting out of here." My point is, if you're not continuing the sentence outside the dialogue (he said etc), but just breaking up the dialogue for temporality reasons or somesuch, pay attention to the sentence structure. The 'He' has a capital letter in the right way not because of the period at the end of the sentence (because remember, the period and the comma before the closed quotation marks are not audible) but because it is a new sentence.
- Similarly, there is a full stop at the end of He takes a long pull of his beer before slamming it back on the table. because it's the end of a sentence before the beginning of a new one, not a Sam says to Dean, "We're getting out of here."
Last one on sentencing with dialogue:
Wrong way:
"But," Sam pants, breathing hard before puffing out on a laugh. "This is a gay bar, Dean! There are no succubi."
Right way:
"But," Sam pants, breathing hard before puffing out on a laugh, "this is a gay bar, Dean! There are no succubi."
Note that:
- This passage is a complete, self-contained sentence. The authorial text breaking up the dialogue refers to the dialogue both before and after it. Therefore, there are commas and lowercase.
Now to talk about paragraphing! Hoorah!
Wrong way:
"Damn it all, Dean," Sam grumbled. "What? What'd I do this time?" Dean replied.
Right way:
"Damn it all, Dean," Sam grumbled.
"What? What'd I do this time?" Dean replied.
Note that:
- Each time a new character speaks - whether it's Dean, the succubus, or the pool cue - you need to start a new paragraph. Do not start a new paragraph every time you use quotation marks (see examples above).
And if you're writing a Lord of the Rings crossover, you might find yourself wielding hefty paragraphs, nay, pages of dialogue, that is hopefully broken up into paragraphs. But wait - that's confusing! You only start a new paragraph if it's a new speaker, don't you? WRONG! Here's how you do it:
Wrong way:
"I don't know, Dean," Sam begins with that tone that's come to set off alarm bells of DANGER! DANGER! LONG-ASS CHICK FLICK CONVERSATION AHEAD! in Dean's head. "I don't think I can bludgeon that succubus over the head. Firstly, there is no succubus, because this is just a lame-ass example for a grammar tutorial, but more importantly when I was twelve a girl at school brought her Barbie to show and tell and, well, the plasticky blonde hair of the doll and the bodily hair that had been drawn in with a red Sharpie kind of reminded me of Mom, and I started crying. And you know what happens why I cry, Dean, my tears melt the silicon of the film stock and cause some kind of nuclear reaction and I just... I'm sure that if Dad had got me that pony I wanted for Winter Solstice I would have been a much less hormonal teenager."
"But, those days are beyond us, now. What were we talking about again?"
Right way:
"I don't know, Dean," Sam begins with that tone that's come to set off alarm bells of DANGER! DANGER! LONG-ASS CHICK FLICK CONVERSATION AHEAD! in Dean's head. "I don't think I can bludgeon that succubus over the head. Firstly, there is no succubus, because this is just a lame-ass example for a grammar tutorial, but more importantly when I was twelve a girl at school brought her Barbie to show and tell and, well, the plasticky blonde hair of the doll and the bodily hair that had been drawn in with a red Sharpie kind of reminded me of Mom, and I started crying. And you know what happens why I cry, Dean, my tears melt the silicon of the film stock and cause some kind of nuclear reaction and I just... I'm sure that if Dad had got me that pony I wanted for Winter Solstice I would have been a much less hormonal teenager.
"But, those days are beyond us, now. What were we talking about again?"
Note that:
- In other words, if the character is speaking for long enough without a break that they verbally (and/or thematically) need a new paragraph; don't close the quotation marks at the end of the first paragraph; but open new ones at the start of the second. When the speaker has finished speaking, you can close the quotation marks at the end of that paragraph. This all serves to signify that both paragraphs are the same speaker, and not two different speakers. Make sense?
Wasn't that fun? And while I'm at it, please do not include any of the following terms or their variations in your fanfiction:
- the older man
- the youngest winchester
- the brunette
- the elder
- the taller man
- the naked man
- the older brother
- the hazel-eyed man
I know you might have the urge to 'mix it up' when you feel like you've just typed 'Dean' for the fifth time in one sentence, or if all your characters are male and your 'he's are getting confusing, but studies have proven* that the brain doesn't process names that way - they don't really notice them linguistically, only as signifiers. So the reader is going to be more jolted out of the story by you saying "the eldest Winchester" or "the freckled demon-hunter" instead of Dean for the second time in five words, which they won't even process. Mmmkay? Trust me on this one.
Er, I've used a couple of these name-alternatives in the examples above to demonstrate correct and incorrect uses of upper- and lower-case (as names always start with uppercase).
Please feel free to share this post with anyone you think desperately, desperately needs it. Cmon, fanfic readers and anal grammaticians web-wide, represent!
PS. uh, if you're an actual grammatician, feel free to correct me. Because, like, I was never actually properly taught grammar, I just read bucketloads and know what feels right. Like.
* please don't ask me what studies, I have no idea, it's third-hand knowledge, but I do know as a dedicated fanfiction reader that I really, really notice more when you use these bullshit name-alternatives.
eta: at
almostnever's suggestion, I've changed all the 'inverted commas' in this to 'quotation marks', which ought to be more universally recognisable terminology :D
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should be:
"Wait." He sounds a little hazy, like he's a few Tibetan prayer flags to the wind. "You want me to what?"
b.x :)
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PS. thanks :D
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b.x :D
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Thanks for making this point!
I've been beta reading for years now and I don't know how often I encountered variations such as "the green eyed teen" (standing for Harry Potter) or "the silver haired vampire" (Spike) or "the brunette Jedi" (Obi-Wan).
I always pointed out that you don't find descriptions like this in well-written novels. I can't remember a single instance where Rowlings calls Harry Potter a "teen" or "raven-haired teen" or anything of that sort.
In the Due South fandom, I encountered the phenomenen that one writer used different names for the same character. Stanley Raymond Kowalski was named Ray or Stanley or Kowalski in turn - and the story was written from his point of view. Gah! Stuff like this can totally ruin a story for me.
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I am abnormally observant when it comes to reading, but not so much when it comes to other things, so I guess it all balances out in the end :)
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And oof, multi-named characters are a blessing but mostly a curse.
And I totally agree about ruining a story... regardless of how good it might be otherwise, little things like this totally taint stories terribly for me :/
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I will say that even though I consider myself kind of a grammar snob, I was mightily confused by this lesson at first becaaaause... I'm American and we don't call those "inverted commas", we call them "quotation marks". If you're going to pimp this (very nice! useful!) lesson out to US writers, they're probably going to "Bzuh?" at you. Word to the wise!
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And dialogue is tricksy! I'm glad you found this useful :)
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thanks!
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How're you doing with the RSF fundraising?
<3
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but you know me. i gave up long ago on anything that happens outside the actual beta process.
*hugs*
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anyway, it made me feel better to hammer it all out on the keyboard :D
*cling*!
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There is one writer in Lotrips that I can't even read, her punctuation is so deplorable, and yet she refuses -- refuses -- to change it. Argh. So I never click the linky, or I find myself helplessly annoyed.
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*clings like a spider monkey*
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Feh on epithets (aka name-alternatives)! So hard to read. Sometimes you can rearrange sentances to avoid names, cos they do get old after a while.
My current pet peeve is dialog where one speaker frequently says the other person's name or endearment. Listen to people talking! Am I using your name now? NOOOO. You know I'm talking to you. It's a little more common in groups, but I once listened to a group of eight and we didn't use either one for a half hour! Now I think that might be partly just our style, but it's somewhat representative. The cool thing is that when you do use a name or endearment, they have more power.
(And the worst is fic set currently in which the LOTR cast calls each other by role-names as if that's who they are. "Hobbits" and "elf" is bad enough, but "Ring-bearer"???? When it's done too much, it makes the fic literally unreadable.
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on the whole i am a descriptive grammarian, but i can't figure out how to be a descriptive.. er.. punctuatarian.
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ah, hope has the best commenters. commentators? anyway. you made my day with that.
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je t'adore
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What? WHAT? um, okay then. o___O
rearranging is definitely preferred to epithets (that word always makes me feel like i'm lisping).
I've noticed that people tend to use your name in conversation when there's a power play going on. either they're talking up or down to you. which is an irritating thing to notice, once you start doing so.
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*cranky mccrankypants*
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