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As much as Dean is beta to John's alpha, he's also totally pussy-whipped by Sam.

Or rather, as much as Dean is pussy-whipped by Sam, he's totally beta to John's alpha.

When it comes to making decisions etc, Dean will always succumb to Sam's giant gleaming eyeballs look. See: Skin ("But St Louis is four hours behind us! No fucking way." *giant gleaming eyeballs* *car turns around*), Nightmare ("Promise me you'll follow my lead on this one!" etc).

So I think a good part of what pisses Sam off so much about the remote orders from Daddy-O via text message is that it's pretty much the only time that Dean won't budge to Sam's will. Because no matter how much Sam bitches and whines and threatens and goes all chibi-eyed, if Dad's given orders, Dean will follow them. Sam's bugged by the fact there are orders at all, sure, but he's also bugged by the fact that John's above him in the pecking order. Not that he cares so much that Dean's on the bottom. Well, he feels incensed on Dean's behalf that John orders him around like a good little soldier, but feels no such qualms when it's Sam himself ordering Dean around (because you know, their techniques are different!).

Not that Dean's complaining. I doubt that Dean angsts about being below them in the pecking order, I think he just wants their orders to be the same.

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that last sentence just breaks my HEART, jeez.

Well, yaknow, Dean.

I'm still not USED to it!!! *flaily hands*

I had thinky thoughts up to this line:

Not that he cares so much that Dean's on the bottom.

And then my brain went to places.

I blame the rum. And the half-digested squirrels.

And then my brain went to places.

Likewise. *cheers you*

I blame the rum. And the half-digested squirrels.

have you been feeding your cat by masticating and regurgitating into its dish again? you have an unhealthy relationship with that creature. you're reminding me of john winchester.

If John ever fed the boys like that, I think I might go off him.

Or possibly not. Not if he spoke. Or smiled. Or just, like, existed.

*swoons*

yes, but it totally works if you're like, doing some animalistic crackfic thing. like cmon, if john came back to the hotel room one day and he'd been cursed by some bird-witch or something, the boys would be O_O at first, but then they'd totally adjust within 24 hours to having their diner food regurgitated down their throats.

Well, Dean would line up for it like a good little soldier, Sammy would follow Dean's lead because OMG DEAN UR THE COOLEST I WILL DO EVERYTHING LIEK YOU LOLZ

PS LOOK I FORGOT I HAD ANOTHER JOHN ICON! WIN

CRAZY EYE JOHN.

Also, you need to stop thinking about John regurgitating hamburgers into Dean's mouth and start thinking about BODY-SWAP PORN.

WHO SAID THE TWO ARE MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE??

also ahahahahahah gmail's suggestions for articles i might be interested in when i'm reading this comment thread include 'jeffreymachine.com'.

DON"T MIND IF I DO

IF YOU GET REGURGITATION IN MY YOUR BODYSWAP PORN, I WILL SET MY CAT ON YOU.

Bwahahaha! I think I'd quite like a Jeffrey Machine. Can it be fully functional and programmed in multiple pleasuring techniques, please?

i was going to reply with more details about the possible jeffrey machine, but i think i'll just sit here and think about them instead.

LOOK DERRY I MADE A NEW JOHN ICON JUST FOR OCCASSIONS SUCH AS THIS!

YOU SHOULD BE WRITING BODYSWAP PORN, NOT MAKING ICONS.

Although - hot John icons may be an exception. Maybe.

ALRIGHT ALRIGHT!

I might be a little bit tipsy. unsure of whether this will be a hlep or hindrance in making pron.

PS shall i put you down as sub-editor on the johnslash ed of evp, yes?

Tipsy is good. It means your porny id gets to come out and play and you write complete and utter filth, with Dean calling John 'Daddy' as he fucks him. And Dean-in-John's-body getting totally turned on by the visual of John's body dominating and subduing and fucking Dean's body.

*cough*

And yes! I shall sub-edit Johnslash very very happily!

O.O

Okay, i have started writing. I now have... *wordcounts* 57 words! and the next one is 'dick'! yay!

PS do you have aim?

Wheee!

And I do have aim - very imaginatively, I am derryderrydown

okay, for that comment gmail suggests: Wired News: Top Stories - God Bless This Lube - 5 hours ago

I am wheeeeelijah, and i am PINGING YOU RIGHT NOW. RIGHT NOW.

RIGHT....

......NOW.

I think that's been one of Sam's daddy-issues for most of his life. Dean is his other source of comfort / parenting / refuge / etc. -- Sam went oedipal on Dean- having no mother to make that transferrence to- so he's lived his life vying with Dad for Dean's affections / attention / affirmation / etc.

Yup.

Oh wow, you know, I never even thought of it this way until you said it, but DUDE. That seems very true.

And the best part is, none of these silly men realize it. :)

So true- especially Sammy- oh, silly boys.

Interestingly, it's a theory I've harbored for a while now, but only when I was writing up my response did I manage to get it so concise and nod at the outright oedipal. Heh. Win for spontaneity! ;D

Thanks. :)

i like the oedipal reading, huh. Though i never entirely buy stories that go all-out on the dean-replacing-mommy thing. i think dean would have still been a kid (and behaved like one). i think the flashback in SW showed that. even though he was being domestic, he was still acting like a kid/brother.

Oh I agree Dean-as-Mom isn't a sell. It's definitely *not* an issue of Dean's behavior. I see it as entirely a matter of Sam's perceptions, his family dynamics, his transferrence. Dean isn't a mom and doesn't think or behave like one, but he's the other primary care giver- even if he's a little kid. Besides, Sam has no other true basis of comparison; getting jealous of Dad for Dean's attention/affection could be a case of only natural considering how they live.

</ babble >

:D

Dude, yes. Yes. This is what I've thought all along, but never bothered to put into words because it might just be lumped into the Sam-hating/woobie Dean-loving pile, which was, you know, not the point. So, thank you.

well, i love them BOTH, JUST AS MUCH, SO ALL THE EITHER-SIDE-OF-THE-FENCE FOLKS CAN SHOVE IT IN THEIR POOPERS.

Not that he cares so much that Dean's on the bottom

Oh, believe me, he does care. He does.

he cares all night long.

oh, I wanna watch him care. *sigh*

Sam is a spoilt brat and that's Dean's fault-- look at the way he indulges his little brother in "Something Wicked..." Sam probably grew up knowing that he could get anything he wanted from Dean if he whined hard enough. Possibly part of the reason why Sam resents Dad's rule so much-- because when Dad says "no" he really means NO.

Dean, on the other hand, doesn't like to fight, at least not within Family. He's the peacemaker, the UN in the middle of the Dad-Sam war. He'd much rather come to a compromise than fight to get his own way, and in the Winchester tradition, compromise == Dad gets his way and the boys shut it.

Interesting thoughts. Hmmm.

Sam has elements of spoiled brattishness, but i don't necessarily think that's as negative as so many people make it out. I think sam's spoilt-ness leads to him not setting the standards of his life too low, if that makes sense? he's willing to aim for what he wants, because he's been raised to know that he can get it. not necessarily that he's *entitled* to it, yaknow?

maybe. interesting indeed.

I doubt that Dean angsts about being below them in the pecking order, I think he just wants their orders to be the same.
Yes. Oh, Dean.

OH DEAN INDEED.

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